Bourbon of Proof: Kenny Eliason (Full Episode)

So they'll come to us, send them out to attorney share, or attorney share, hooks them up with the right person. And then after that, the attorney can sign them up under the app. Yeah, so we're building with Quillie as the ability to, if a person on St. Morrow's firm has an app, consumer hits a button, says I have a case that whatever referral, if it fits his criteria, it'll go to Morrow's firm. But if it doesn't, he can still monetize that referral fee by pushing you to attorney share. So it's like having that widget in your pocket, your brand and law firm, which is sticky. Now, so Morrow's just out there doing TV shows. That's our dream. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then people are just like clicking a button because they love Morrow's and it's odd job. That's right. This is my Heisenberg. Welcome to this episode of Bourbon of Proof, where we interview those who have been both successful at law and life. And today we have on straight from Las Vegas on the four hour, did you just shorter than four hours? Just over four. Just over four. Kenny Eliason, thank you for coming on, brother. Hey, what's up with you? Thanks, guys. As always, we're, well, lately we're at Morrow's Clubhouse in the Hollywood Hills. No. Thanks for having me. I'm sorry for the weird spells of cigarettes and sadness. It's called despair. (all laughing) The bar has been spare. Hello. Thank you very much. Nice to be here, Bob. You know, we've done a few of these episodes before, but we do these non-alcoholic episodes. Everything's we drank a lot of alcohol and we do, but sometimes... This is close, right? No. I didn't mind these probably worse. You know, I didn't know these were for you because they just showed up in the refrigerator here a couple days ago, and I've been drinking this. And then I was reading the notes this morning and I was like, "Oh, shit, they're for that." One minute to just play for me. Oh, I didn't drink a ball. So Kenny's another tech founder, but also grew up in the space. I mean, you used to do, you know, was it intake? I mean, you guys, you did a lot of stuff like that. I started as a Spanish-speaking translator is all I was doing at the law firm for a long time. Oh, of course, of course. Yeah. Let me give you a little pour. Hey, thank you. Oh, don't take it easy on it, you know? But yeah, I did that for a while and just haven't left since, you know? It kind of looks like Maro's pee after having a few vitamins. Did you know that there's actually pee in Mountain Juice? Did you know that? That's tough. That's true. But I was a kid, everyone said, "Don't you know there's pee in there." I mean, it looks like it. Oh, God, it's good as I remember. Yes, so Kenny, coming straight from Las Vegas. First of all, why'd you decide to drive rather than fly? 'Cause by the time you wake up early, get to the airport, wait for the airplane, get off the airplane, get a car. I'm here already, so... To me and Bob don't have those promises, we have a private jet. Hey, that's nice. I'm not there quite yet. Mine's called the SWA. That's nice. But they fly every half hour. Yeah, yeah, it's true. It's true. Half West Airlines. It's true. You just gotta get the early, you know? Now I have my car down here so I can drive wherever I want to. Go see some other people. That's true. Who else do you want to see around here? By the way, we're very tucked away. It's just Barrow, P Didi, a couple other folks up here. Yeah, yeah, we've stopped by a couple other firms that we work with down here, so. Nice. Yeah, so we'll cut some a little bit here. One of the products you have is a customer facing app, so law firms can have their own app where clients can communicate directly to the law firm, have certain deliverable stuff like that. What's the name of it? Quilia. Quilia. Thank you. It's like a quill. It's also a preferred vendor of Justice HQ, by the way, man. So we're going to start showing people how to create their own apps. That's right, man. That's right. Yes, we've been helping clients more like a platform for clients, like you got your file lines, Clio's, and everything for the law firm, or that for the client themselves, so. Save communications, these type of things. Communications, data aggregation, employment track, I mean, basically anything from signature, like signed client, through a disbursement. So imagine at the end of the case, we're digging a notification. Here's this breakdown of the cash flows, except money transfers, no more paper checks for life. Yeah, still writing paper checks, the law firm. Yeah. Sure. Somebody is, right? Yes. It happens all the time, still surprising to me. When we were interviewing people, how much time is eaten up by signed paper checks by the attorneys themselves at the first time? Well, my clients are not bank accounts or IDs. You have to go and open up the account. A lot of them have Venmo's cash apps, PayPal's, and those are the types of things. Can you add, can Margo and sign the check on behalf of Medicare, so we could deposit? There you go. [LAUGHTER] Face the order of moral fuel is trust account. Yeah. So yeah, that's what we-- Hey, no cheating here. You got to drink that. Oh, yeah, for sure. Let's talk him more drinky. We also-- I also pulled a non-alcoholic spirit here. It says Liar's white cane spirit. Mm-hmm. Never had this on the show? It's like a monkey drinking on the month. Yeah. And it looks like it has some kind of map. I don't know what it's going to be. I don't know, have we ever had a good non-alcoholic on yourself? Give it to me yet. No, no, no, no, no, no, not you. I think one thing we had this non-alcoholic whiskey that was so bad, Liar almost puked. I think you did. I think I did puke it out. But let's see. This is like-- I'll let you finish your dew before you start this. Oh, there it was. Oh, this smells like my grandma's closet. Oh, dear. You know what's like the mock balls? Oh, dear. He used to hide in there. Yeah. Just wait. And? It tastes like nothing. Yeah. It smells stronger than it tastes. It actually tastes like nothing. There's hardly a taste at all. The smell is stronger. Yeah. Oh, god, that's bad. No, it does taste bad. Yeah, I mean, it's not great. Bad, though. Let's see how it mixes them up and do. Good. It's-- Yeah, mask it with something. But how-- I mean, why did you find the cure? Because you're working for law firm in Nevada, Vegas. And it's like, you know, there's a hole in the market. So my favorite thing back when I worked at the firm was helping the clients, right? Oh, this actually really good with the nom dude. Yeah, that actually didn't prove the taste. But I love helping the clients. And especially the Spanish being clients, I realized really quickly, they are even at a bigger detriment than the English-speaking clients because it was impossible for them to-- It's clearly also due to Spanish. Oh, yeah, it's also due to all the languages. And so by way of helping the clients so much and by rising up to the office, I helped all the legal assistance and case managers and firm do all the stuff they're supposed to do. And so much of my job ended up being helping people to get up-to-date so that they could talk to their clients better. And so I did that for 10 years, you know? I actually went to law school for a year. Oh, the fun story. And then you have the TV show. And then the TV show? Yeah. You're smiling down? Oh, yeah, that's it. He has the Kenny Powers haircut. Oh, yeah. Also big BMX rider, duh, and the-- Yeah, you ever get confused with Kenny Powers with that hair? No, I haven't got that one. I haven't got that one. He has to walk us through, you know? Yeah, man. So when you're law school, it's like, fuck this. We're going to go-- I mean, we can get into the weeds there. That's kind of fun. They kicked me out. That's the first year. Oh, I love this evening. When in law school, did you go? California Western, San Diego. Oh, yeah, I know Calwestern. So I-- Gene Sullivan went to Calwestern. Nice. I come from like zero educational background. I had no idea what I was doing. First college graduate, first guy I didn't even try to go to law school. So I was on my-- so I accepted like five schools toward the mall, chose Calwestern, had no idea what I was choosing. A year in, I find out that Calwestern-- you guys probably know this, but-- every law school to keep the bar passagrates up, because the bottom percent of the first year class-- Yeah, some-- we have some-- they do that. And like, most schools, if they're cutting them, it's like 3%. Very low-- like, the kids that never showed up at a class 100, like, three kids go home. Calwestern cuts 33% of the last year. Yeah. So I had a high C, like a low B, got the boot. So I moved back to Vegas after that. And that's why you're actually making money, because you were a seedless-- Well, there's a little bit of difference. Yeah, exactly. He's-- you don't meet anybody in law school. He's like, oh, stop the class. Guess what? You're still in the-- he's doing a discovery. Well, you know, Bob, I once taught the class at my school. But, you know, I'm an anomaly. Where'd you guys go? Oh, I don't talk-- I don't just go. [LAUGHTER] I went to University of West Los Angeles. Oh, OK, cool. An unaccredited night school in Englewood. Hey, cool. Very-- a pillar of the legal profession. I mean, it's so funny, you know? These law schools, everybody thinks that the name matters. Like, you get the license. Probably, Pepperdine and Malibu. Bet you're asking me to go to Malibu. First time I flew a plane, I looked at law schools, looked at look here, and I was like, yep. This is getting-- I thought the same thing about San Diego. Yeah, San Diego's beautiful down there. Isn't Cal Westroom like in the Gaston district, down there, kind of? Right down the street, yeah. Just outside. That's where they'd be bad. And Thomas Jefferson's right there, too. TJ's right there. Not my brother, my brother. He was right there. So it's crazy that I was a friend of a lot of the kids that went to the other law schools. Most of them had worst grades than me after the first year. I got the boot. They've been practicing law for almost 15 years. Yeah, if you've got Cal Westroom on the bottom, it doesn't mean you couldn't have made it through. Why didn't you just go to different school? So that was definitely-- The first question-- What year was this? Where was it? 2010, just when I was there. In none of its transfers, you got to start over. So-- Wow, that's fucked up. The debt, everything about it, was done. So I don't know if I'm going to reset and go back. Well, I'll be getting to do it all over again. So that's not a cool issue, at least. Let it transfer. Crazy, right? Crazy. And I had already-- I was planning on doing it in two and a half years. So I was already full speed ahead into the middle of the summer semester when I got the email. And then I had to go talk to them. So it sucked. Did it-- Had a brand new baby. It's really. Did a fight in Sioux? I mean, I don't know if somebody's-- Oh, it was rough. It was rough. I was in there every day. They tell you, OK, the only way you can stay is if you can get your grade up. And the only way you can get your grade up is if you go convince your law professors that they graded your assignment wrong. And if you remember law professors, they're notoriously not very humble people. And so they have no interest in reevaluating the grades. They get them messed up. Like, I mean, what kind of asshole power chair? It's crazy, dude. I had no idea. I was caught off guard so bad. That wasn't even a possibility. I made it. Like I passed the LSAT. I got into the school. I did all the things. Well, back on the street. Well. But it worked out. Then it worked out. I went back home, worked at a law firm. Went back to the law firm as a case manager. I was like, I want to do this forever. I can't be just a case manager. And so I started a tech and marketing company. I did that for a total of years after that. And became a developer, did a ton of marketing campaigns. I'm kind of a hacker by trade, kind of. Like, just like I figured things out. Yeah, we heard about your hack and your Tesla really. We won't talk about it yet. I'm not talking about it on here. But yeah, I got into the marketing scene. We were originally not-- I was outsourcing the website development. And then eventually realized how crappy that was. Started fixing websites, started building websites. Gave a developer to that for the law firm you're working for. Oh, no. So Richard Harris, where were you at? You were at-- no, Ting E law firm? Oh, yeah. I'm good friends with Rick, though, a long-time family friend, Ting E law firm out there. But no, I was working for law firm and doing that at night. And then eventually, we landed this big old client for the marketing and I left law and did that. I built tons of legal websites over the decade of doing it. But I was doing it for people all at the nation. Building websites and doing marketing campaigns, SEO, social media, all that stuff. It was early days, too. We were one of the earliest social media marketing companies in 2011. Like nobody was really-- nobody was there. And so-- I wasn't even on Instagram yet. Right. Exactly. I was on Instagram because some of my first pictures are at law school. Oh, man, it's really not-- yeah. Go back to Wonder what our first photos were on Instagram. Remember, I created a Facebook account because when I met my wife that night, I thought she was on Facebook. I had to create a account to try to like stalk her. She was not my top eight friends in my space, though. We said, I pivoted over. Maharo's still on Twitter, but it's not a picture of him. It's a picture of his friend. Right? Still, do you do that? Wasn't a picture of Gary Dordic that he had a picture instead of you? I might have had Gary Dordic as my profile. Yeah, he did, actually. I think I still do have it. It's Nick Rowley and Gary. They're both in the picture. They're my profile on Twitter, or X. I haven't logged into X, right? I don't understand anymore. I had to delete X because it's just too addicting, too much craziness. What train wreck are we going to look at today? Death scrolling. Yeah, for real, just grain rot. Stop. Maharo just looks at reels. Yeah, I like to look at reels. If you ever pull up in your search term on Instagram and just see what Instagram thinks that you want to see, I bet you would just be having guys playing golf and people in strip clubs. Those are two of the top three. Maharo doesn't mean a lot of reels. He just dms me these very funny things. Yeah, when I see something that's like really ridiculous, I'll send it to Bob. Then when I saw the inspiration, I'm like, wow. He's growing up. [LAUGHTER] Not going to work. So one of the biggest things, like mistakes, you're going back 2011. Yeah. I mean, you were one of the first early adopters on this. I mean, it's evolved immensely. But what are some things that lawyers can do better? What do they do wrong on social media and on websites? Do this test when you get home. They go on a chat GPT and tell it to make a picture of a personal injury attorney. Just say, what's the stereotypical personal injury look like? It will pull up an image, I guarantee it. That looks like every billboard you've ever seen. That big guy with a face smiling, pointing at the sign. That's not what you want to do. You want to stand out. You want to be different. And so change it up. And AI tools are a great way to brainstorm. Find your unique strength. What's going to happen over the evolution of PI is, for the longest time, there was so much money in PI that you could just get away with anything as far as marketing went. You get referrals. I mean, you just made money. But now as insurance companies are squeezing, every cost are rising, everything's changing. There's going to be optimizations that happen like using technology like we're talking about today. But other technologies that are out there that are going to be required in order to keep making the kind of money you've been making before. You've got to save costs. You've got to make the amounts of the settlements go up. And so by doing that, what remains is you're only asset, which is your personal brand. Like you, like who you are and what you do. And so don't wait to be squeeze out of the market before you focus on that. Focus on who you are today, what makes you different, what makes you unique. Come up with a way to brand that to your current clients. They're the most underutilized asset in the '99 set of the time of the law firms. They're your best referral source that you have. And build them up and then roll that into place. And that's what, like I was saying, you don't want a consumer searching for like personal injury, Las Vegas lawyer, right? They want to search for moral theory because they want to look for him. Right, that's sticky, right? That's what they're looking for you. Yeah, and that's the full arc. Like initial, the small guys, they can't afford the billboards all over town. So they can't know, they can't get to that point until they maybe land the big case or whatever it is. But the scale of getting there, and maybe you remember this back before you guys, when you guys were small time, like you've got to really capitalize on every single case, both increasing the value of your case. I don't know if it is. No, you don't have to, but he's-- No, yeah, you're good, I guess. It's got to do. These mix very good. Yeah, they do. It goes better together than it was in itself. Yeah, sure. Just a little taste of the 15-year old fits. Now this is a special bottle. Oh, nice. [LAUGHTER] Now we'll do a little porous, OK? Just a little bit. Just a tiny order. Good after. You've got to get that white sugar cane lighter stuck in all of this. [LAUGHTER] No, but I think what you do is the interesting use case, because I think more and more folks, and everybody's on their smartphone, and they're going to have to be able to push a button to talk. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Chat with their lawyer, legal issue. What I wanted to do is be that brand. Yeah. So for tomorrow, imagine everybody having your Fiori Legal app. He's doing merch drops, doing all these things. All your ongoing stuff, the case is long over, but you're going to sponsor a movie theater or whatever, a game night, and that pops into the app. Boom, now the client remembers who you are for forever. I mean, you get them locked in. That app doesn't get deleted most of the time. It's your own little business card that lives on forever with a ton of upside, so. Oh, this is good. But now that's whenever consumers can go download your app right now without even having a lawyer. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So right now, if somebody tries to send up without a lawyer, we don't accept them as a sign-up. What we do is refer them out using a really good company. What was the name again? Attorney share. So they'll come to us. They have to have representation because everything we put into the app is privileged information. So you've got to have an attorney before you start putting anything in. Send them out to attorney share, attorney share. Hooks them up with the right person in the area or wherever their needs are. And then after that, the attorney can sign them up under the app. Yeah, so we're building with Quillie as the ability to, if a person on, St. Morrow's firm has an app, consumer hits a button, says, I have a case, I have a referral. If it fits his criteria, it'll go to Morrow's firm. But if it doesn't, you can still monetize that referral fee by pushing to attorney share. So it's like having that widget in your pocket. You're branded law firm, which is sticky now. So Morrow's just out there doing-- Whatever. TV shows, that's our dream. And then people are just clicking a button because they love Morrow's. It is odd jobs right over here. That's right, I like it. This is my highs and your cat. That is the higher and the very bad, right there. You think you could throw it like you think it'd hurt somebody? Put some blades in the end. I don't know, it's kind of expensive. I want to turn it down. Where'd you get that? I bought it at Gorn Brothers, it was like $300. What's this? Oh, it does say the Heisenberg in there. Actually, that's good. Oh, it really is. Yeah, I know. This was a-- and it came in this big box and it has Heisenberg on the box and it had some fake packs of blue meth in the box. And I still haven't in my upstairs offering. Did you search this out, or did you-- Well, it was during when the show was on, and I saw it advertised or something, and I went into the Gorn Brothers store in Pasadena, and they had one of them. So they only made 200 of them. This is-- that's like numbered on the box stuff. And like, Gorn Brothers stores in there in New York, Pasadena. Have you ever been to Gorn Brothers? They had stores. They're really cool stores. They were around forever. But I think now they just are online. One of those things that just went online, they just closed their real store. But they had a really cool hat store in Pasadena. You could go in there and they'd fit it. Yeah, you see the evolution of the retail and stuff like that. Like, why are people doing a lot of brick and mortar when you have so much access? These were maybe it's a showroom. Yeah, for sure. Same thing for law firms. I mean, you have your showroom, the rest is digital. Yep, that's what happens. I have a fun fact about hats. So I love hats and like a big hat guy. But I have the biggest hat ever. So I can only wear very few hats. I have a size eight head. So I custom-- I've got my head. My head is-- Custom order all-- you know, I've done-- I'm 7 and 3. I'm like, I'm like 7 and 3. I'm so close. You're close. You're close. Size eight, big head, big head. Anyway. I'm almost-- I've been very small heads. I'm like, 6 and like-- Oh, dang, the opposite. I think my son-- my son, Max, who's 6, has a bigger head than mine. Yeah. I'm almost fine with it when I was born. Hey, yeah, I'm sure. My twin brother came out of breach though, so that-- Oh, didn't help. Didn't help. Didn't help. You probably didn't even know that. You didn't even know what a breach maybe is probably. When they were born with an ass first? Yeah, feet ass, whatever. [LAUGHTER] Yeah, I mean, but you've seen the evolution of this game, then, man. I mean, there's so many lawyers that could do so well just with social media by being branded. Totally. They don't have to compete in the SEO span. But I mean, that's evolving, too. Like, it's getting crazy every day. I mean, podcast is a big, huge opportunity for a ton of people to really get their real brand out. But yeah, social media has changed every day. The networks people are using are changing every day. It's a fast-moving machine. SEO is evolving every day. I have been in still offer a huge advocate of SEO, but it's a long-term game. What's crazy now is AI optimization, which-- I mean, I've seen AI that they can write a million pages of SEO in a day. Which changes the game significantly. A day? A day. Well, this is what we were talking about. It's like, if you can write content for every mass tort, for instance, you don't have to do it. That's why you could put-- my vision is to get that to the best lawyers fast as you can. But you should be able to monetize that internet billboard that you have, right? So just plug in the widget, and all of a sudden you're-- It'll swing like a dorks. Right now, yeah, right now AI is generating all the content. And search engines and everybody knows that it's AI-generated content. So that's when Google slap you on the wrist. Once it-- I mean, if you're just regurgitating the same stuff that's found online all over the place, then yeah, you're not going to get much ranking. But if you're using it to maybe help you apply it on something that's unique to you, that you have experience on yourself, then it can have value there still. That's why I think media podcasts are good, because that's-- It's raw. That's content. It's raw content. And you can still use AI to use SEO to do it. Oh, for sure. Yep. Big deal. I mean, another interesting test that I see people doing now is not just Google optimization, but the AI optimization inside of Chatelecty or Grocker, pick your thing who's the best LA personal injury attorney, and see who showed up. Who Grocker, who Chatelecty you recommend is interesting. It's a pretty interesting experiment. I recommend trying it, because you never know. So I tried it early on to do those things, and it would pull up some of my verdicts. Yeah, it's said that different people try them and have the wrong answer to get this information. It's crazy. But that was a year and a half ago, so it's probably gone better. Right now, if you're using Chatelecty, you'll notice that it actually is thinking in real time sometimes. So if you tell it to do something and it messes up, while it's giving you the answer, it'll say, hey, I did that wrong. Let me redo it again, and it'll keep going through. So it's checking itself now, and the models are just getting so good. So it's much more accurate. I mean, I'm not recommending it for legal document citation or whatever, core case citation. But the stuff it's output now is getting better and better. And it's just a cool test, because people are using it that way. Like consumers now, consumers aren't right. Exactly, like my daughter is getting raised on Chatelecty. She's never going to Google anything. You know, like that's old news to her. She's playing on the phone all the day in Chatelecty. Chatelecty, as to how old is your daughter? How old is your daughter? Oh, yeah, that's right. You got it. I had a-- we had encyclopedias when I was-- Bro, totally. Then you had to order new ones every year, you know what I'm saying? And just take a bottle of those shelves, nobody would ever look at him. I've seen his encyclopedias. He actually took the time to carve out the pages. Inside the shape of a bottle to give up. He says bottles, and it's just encyclopedias. Oh, man. I would put you in one of your pistols in there or something. I have a book that says "Fake Book" on my nightstand. It's actually has a gun in it. Oh, wow. And it says on the cover of the book, it says-- Bible? Bedtime Stories for Uninvited, yes. There you go. So it says on the book, and there's a gun in it. That's awesome. He's not a lion. That's awesome. I went shooting with this guy one time, and he pulled out this fucking elephant gun that blew me like 10 feet back after it. Well, especially if you never shot a shotgun, you don't know that. You really have to hold none of that. Just like this long, like a pistol in this long. And he had a hold none of that stuff. They kicked pretty hard. You ever have to shoot anybody any time? I've been shot at, but I never got off a shot. But the nice thing was is that I was arguing with the guy robbing us, and he shot my friend instead of me. So to this day, he tells me, you fuck her. I didn't say a fucking word, and the guy shot me. I was like, fuck you, man. And then he shot my friend. I was like, OK. What do you want? He slowed you down. Yeah. Shot him, man. And then I was like, dude, you're fine, dude. I'll fucking wrap up your hand with some backteen. We're good. If I take you to fucking hospital with a gunshot wound, they're going to get the cops involved. He's such a pussy, he made me take me to the hospital. And I was like, dude, oh, you'll be fine. Let me fix it. Whatever happened to his hand. They took it. You're not going to get lost. I mean, to this day, he says, I should have sued you. I should have barely used my thumb. I was like, you're fucking fine, fuck off. He got shot with a shotgun from close range. But luckily, he kind of moved. So instead of blowing his hand off, it kind of made me just maybe part of his thumb. But it's OK. They kind of stuck it back on. It'll be fine. We have this-- you know, when they follow your clients with video cameras, see if they're lying there. By the way, we have a trial going on right now. And by the time this error, it'll be cat on the bag. But the defense has been following the wrong guy. Oh, my gosh. And they just-- Oh, my gosh. They do that a lot. Oh, dude, they're so dumb. And they're going all in on it. So it's going to be very funny. It's going to be very funny. It's blowing up in their face. Because a lot of times, there's like three or four people who live in a house. And they might kind of like be look cousins or whatever. And so they end up following the wrong guy. I had the same thing on the case. They're like, we got him. And all this. I was like, that's not my guy. I don't have any tattoos. You know? Like, that's his cousin. And they had like 500 hours in the cousin. And the cousin was doing all kinds of shit. They're like, we got him. Like, they showed me a video of this guy literally like tearing an engine out of a car. Like, he was like King Kong, like, taking the engine block out. And I'm like, oh, man, I told my client. I said, what the fuck are you doing, man? He goes, that's my cousin, Manny. I don't have any fucking tattoos. I was like, oh, it's not the right one guy. Not this case. Another one actually went to trial and they got busted on it. But they were following the cousin that lived. They lived together. And the guy went out and he's like hiking, jumping around. And he gets in his car and just smokes weed for like an hour in his car. And they're like, we got it. We got it. We don't do drugs. He can't do heights. It's not so long. But Mars went a few ones that actually had one of his clients lose their arm. And they still fall over the camera. It was so devastating that he had to settle the case. With the lost arm. I'll show you this video. Was it the buddy we were talking about a second ago? No, I'll show you this subrosa video. It'll knock your sides off. Well, I can't even describe it here on this video. But the devastation-- It's amazing. Yeah. At least they sent it to you before trial or something. So you got the chance to settle it before. My client was wearing an animal shirt from-- Oh, I forgot the part. No. He's wearing an animal shirt from Sesame Street. No animal? Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. The guy was committing very bad crimes in draw daylight. Oh, man. In an animal shirt with one arm in an animal. He's woke up on a bus stop. And that anarchy is soon soon. It's their fault. Oh, my gosh. So let me ask you, is your business only based in Nevada? Or do you have-- I don't know, we got clients all over the country. You know all over? One of your guys is Kurt Riley, guys, from just HQ. Oh, Brian and Austin. Those are good guys. I like those guys. They're ahead of the curve, man. Yeah, they're killing it. They're killing it, man. They do great fun with them a lot of girls. They do fun videos. Do you do those videos for them? No, no, no. We're strictly on the app now. I don't do any of the markets. Their videos are funny. They do that mostly by themselves. Yeah, well, they're young guys. So they know how to do that. The younger generation knows how to do that stuff. It's changing the guard slowly happening right now. There's a whole new generation coming up. In Arizona, they could pay non-lawyers referrals. Yeah, that's crazy down there. Yeah. They don't have anybody. It's just-- I mean, they're both a attorney. Oh, you're saying for attorney referrals. Yeah, so I bet a woman who has a rideshare company she started in Arizona. And she was competing because she wouldn't have a safe place for women, but he's verified, et cetera. And I was like, what if you put something on your app that's the end of the lawyer, they give you a call? She's like, what? Why not be very interesting? Yeah. Yeah, that's different. Yeah. That's different. So you guys are now just doing this app? Yes, full time, all the time, 24/7. That's all I live and breathe now is this app. It's actually more of a platform. So right now, we're focused on the app, but we have partners that are going to start integrating where your settlement companies can be involved, your body shops can automatically submit property damage estimates into the app. You know, everybody can kind of-- Access to medical care, right? You should be able to do that. Access to medical care. I mean, move docs is right down the street. Yeah, yeah, we know those guys. Yeah, move docs is there. But you remember back in the day when clients carry on their big menila envelope folders of their case file, you know, like they'd show up at our office. And here's everything, boom, they pull out all the paper. It's just a digital version of that at the end of the day with the perks that digital brings. So everything really aren't in their case. And it actually came up because-- well, one of the reasons it came up-- my wife was in a-- what had a really bad medical malpractice knee surgery. And years and years go by because that's how long those cases go. And finally, we get to a mediation, it was a mediation. And the attorney said, hey, can you just tell me a story about how that was? She actually got hurt in March of 2020 was when she got her knee injury surgery in April. And it was just miserable. COVID 10xed with her laid up for forever with a bad surgery. Anyway, she couldn't remember, right? Like three or four years had gone by. She couldn't really-- she remembered high level, but the details that were long forgotten were gone forever. So this is like a change on that, right? Like in the moment, they can document what's going on, and now they can remember that forever. You guys have access to it. And it's all-- if it's with the attorney, it's all client. It's all privileged. Yeah, we actually spoke to a few different discovery commissioners about it. And they said, OK, who invites the client to the app? That's why we have a limitation of who can sign up. And so that attorney invites their client to the app, and then who has access to the information the clients are putting in. And the only person who ever has access to the information clients are putting in is the attorney. Now, we have the option for other people to send stuff in. Like doctors can put appointments in to the app. But they cannot see anything the clients are putting in. Yeah, see. But you do have to have a certain level of sophisticated client to handle-- It's crazy that there's a so user-friendly that it's not-- it's literally just-- You know the test I do with that stuff. But as Bob tells me about all these different things, if I can figure it out, then anybody can do it. I'm going to send you an invite right now. Because I'm very low-end. Here's the thing-- Well, I mean, when it comes to the knowledge-- This is actually something I don't want to talk to you guys about, because we-- I always tell Bob, they should hire me to be a consultant. Well, they did for a little bit. Yeah, and I ended up owning part of the company, because they were so shocked. They were so shocked that my feedback was so fucking good that they were blown away, because I was like, no, you can't be like this, because that requires people that are like might be a little smarter than the average bear. This is the perfect-- I'm like the low average intelligence. So what's the number? So when it comes to clients, there's this weird belief, and I'm guilty of it as much as anybody, that clients are incapable of using technology at any level. But even advanced technology, but that's like maybe law is notoriously behind the times when it comes to technology. And so I think we superimpose that onto our clients lots of times, but 99% of clients out there are very capable of using a simple app, like most everybody's on Facebook or some social network, and they use those. And I would argue those are very complicated lots of times with commenting and resharing and everything that everybody does really easily. So I think it's an old belief now where we're getting past that, that lots of clients can use it, and like 85% of the people that download our app end up using it with the law firm that we have right now. So where's your dream vision look like for Quilia? That master class branded app for the lawyer and the client's hands, what does it look like? Yeah, it's the tool that the second they sign up, we basically, OK, I'll paint the dream dream scenario. No legal staff around right now for the conversation here. But with cost getting schools and settlements getting schools, you're going to have to do more with less. And so fewer staff running more cases. And right now, we can't do that. It doesn't scale well. The staff starts screaming when there's 60, 70 cases in some cases, maybe you get up to 100 in some firms. It's just too much, they get burned up. But if we can offload like 90% of the day-to-day tasks to an app where the clients are willing participants, and they actually enjoy putting stuff into the app, now you can do 200, 300 cases per staff member because they're only doing customer support at that point. They're making sure they're doing-- And can the clients take a picture of something and upload it? 100% videos, photos, documents, discovery. The more you gamify. Discovery, exactly gamification of it all, you know, thanks, you put in the thing, good job. You get a star, you know, like that kind of stuff to help keep them engaged. Yeah, you give a yearly motorcycle giveaway, right? All that, yep, yep. So just making it really easy for-- right now, the clients are disconnected. Having been client to myself, they are-- In communications, they won't-- They'll be holding to the communication they receive and not necessarily when they even reach out. Like, it's like, no, lots of times firms call back when it's convenient, even if I've reached out. And it's just because that's the nature of the business, is it's a busy, busy business, and it's hard to call it. If everybody had only one client, be super easy. You'd call around all the appointments with them to be fantastic, but we can't do that. This is kind of that one-to-one relationship where you can handle more clients using hamster wheels or spinning over there. He's like very interested in this guy. He's kicking in. He was part of the company already. [INTERPOSING VOICES] They're equating you. [INTERPOSING VOICES] Yeah, we're excited. It's cool. The clients have been hungry for this. Would you open the cost of the anti-portal? Because portals have old fail, and they fail for a few reasons, mostly because the second you tell a client, they got a portal. Now the law firm has to keep it updated. And if you're not keeping-- And stuff in there? Now, you're not doing anything on my case. Every new doctor, facilities, we use our portal. And it's like, I got to sign up for another-- [INTERPOSING VOICES] Just look at my medical records. It's like, give me a break. And it puts so much on the firm to keep them updated, like the ongoing pushing into updates. When we all know during treatment, there's not a lot going on in the case. We're just waiting for you to finish treating, and then we're going to send it off to the insurance company. So you can't keep it updated during that time. And in the meantime, they're checking the portal feverishly every day to find out what's going on with the case, and there's nothing, like just a ghost app. So we don't do that. We prompt them to put stuff in that's going on that they are doing, puts it on its head, instead of making a law firm put stuff in. We make the clients put stuff in. And now they participate. They feel like they're hearing from me all the time, because the app's telling them to put stuff in. Makes a better experience for the law firm and for the client. And ends up with better quality cases, too. So are you now happy that they threw out a school? Oh, yeah. 100%-- it could have been better. I actually joke that I felt that three big things in life. Most people only do these three things once. I got married and divorced six months later. I went to law school and got kicked out. I bought a house in '08. So it's been rough. But man, my tourney's got me here, and it's fantastic. I freaking love this thing. Oh, man, that's awesome. Yeah. We usually do it at the end of the show, you know, Ken, what's your bourbon or proof? You could pick what's your favorite. This was not bad. I like the combo. The combo. But what do you-- I mean, like, what do you usually drink? Is it Mountain Dew? Is that your thing? I mean, Mountain Dew is kind of my thing. I used to be a big energy drink drinker, which-- I don't know if that's better or worse than these. I think that's even worse. And I finally-- No, some energy drinker. I finally cut those off. And yeah, I wasn't-- you know, I was like a two-month spread, a day guy for-- That would put a hole in yourself. It was probably way too long. And just like four months ago, I cut back to just the Mountain Dew, which only has like 80 milligrams of caffeine in it, something like that. So compared to like the $500 I was doing before, it was a good drop off. So Mountain Dew is my go-to now, and it gives me just what I need. Yeah. We go through-- when we travel a lot, we go just try different energy drinks around like Europe and stuff. Oh, yeah. So there's one with the tiger on it that we usually get in Spain, and they're super cheap too over there. Oh, really? They're like 95 cents. Exactly. Yeah, they're like 95 cents. These ones that I always buy in Europe, and they're so good. But they have aisles of like non-alcoholic beer. Oh, really? It's a big thing in Europe. Big thing. That's a good thing. They don't mix it up with Mountain Dew. I don't think this is allowed. I don't think Mountain Dew is allowed. They cross it off. You know, it's like e-use. Don't ship it in. They're not big on all the phony coloring stuff, so it's totally different. That's it. Well, can I take you coming on this episode? Yes. We go up and improve how to people find you the best way. Quilio.com, q-u-i-l-i-a.com. I'm on LinkedIn too. Email, phone, whatever I'm on. You can find free. Love it. All right. Well, thanks for coming on, brother, in last years. Yep. [MUSIC PLAYING]